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Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 20 August 2024

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Hezbollah death toll should be updated to 418 killed. Here is the citation on this live from L'orient-Le jour at 09:13 H [1] Anticonstitutionnelist (talk) 12:03, 20 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: the death toll is already sourced. M.Bitton (talk) 01:18, 10 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ https://www.lorientlejour.com/article/1424315/blinken-en-egypte-les-echanges-de-tirs-restent-intenses-au-sud-du-liban-jour-319-de-la-guerre-de-gaza.html

Islamic Azz Brigades as a unit of Hezbollah?

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I'm a bit conflicted on whether "Islamic Azz Brigades" should be moved as a unit of Hezbollah. The group was completely unknown/likely never existed prior to the conflict and most scholars believe that it is a Hezbollah front organization (granting them some form of plausible deniability). It also doesn't appear to have been active for more than a few days, so it might make sense to remove them all together. RisingTzar (talk) 09:27, 30 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

17 Sep pager attack

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Reports are now that up to 3,000 Hezbollah militants were injured in today's pager attack [1]. Since this is the first time a tactic of this sort has succeeded on such a wide scale, it probably deserves its own article. 152.130.15.102 (talk) 20:23, 17 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It does have its own article, 2024 Lebanon pager explosions Chomik! (talk?) 20:37, 17 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 September 2024

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454/455 Hezbollah Members/Fighters have been KILLED not 476. 300+ CRITICALLY/SEVERELY WOUNDED should also be listed BELOW. 2A02:6B6F:F78B:4400:19DA:EF18:2819:B306 (talk) 14:26, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Bunnypranav (talk) 14:09, 19 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mettula

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attack there. https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/ryjm1z5t0 According to the head of the council, more than 30 houses and public buildings were damaged to one degree or another because of the attack ." Half of the houses in the council have been damaged since the beginning of the war.

https://www.kan.org.il/content/kan-news/local/802360/ https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/hytzk0qpr 87.70.22.51 (talk) 13:38, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Added to the Casualties and damage section. Chomik! (talk?) 15:02, 20 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

hospital went Underground

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"The massive shooting at the northern places at Israel leads to dramatic changes in the operating model of the hospitals from Haifa and the north. The Ministry of Health informed this morning (Sunday) that the Rambam Hospital is moving to work in the hospital's secured parking lot. The Carmel, Ziv, Galilee Medical Center in Nahariya, the Emek, Furia, the Italian and the English in Nazareth will also operate in protected areas. In Nahariya, we note , most of the hospital has been operating underground for almost a year."

https://www.ynet.co.il/health/article/s1bnquttr#autoplay 87.70.22.51 (talk) 07:11, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ramat david

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cows were killed. https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/b1j3ozp6c#autoplay

"Alarms were set off throughout the Galilee, the Jezreel Valley and the Carmel in the shooting attack to the north. A fire broke out in the Tzur Moshe neighborhood in Kiryat Bialik and in the settlement of Morshet following a rocket strike. Hezbollah announced that it tried to hit the air force base in Ramat David and the Rafael facility." https://news.walla.co.il/item/3692919

Used new rokects https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/s1cp7matr#autoplay 87.70.22.51 (talk) 07:21, 22 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 23 September 2024

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The Sheeba farms area is not occupied. It was a disputed area between Lebanon Syria and Israel. The UN recognised that Israel withdrew to international borders in May 2000 https://www.reuters.com/article/world/un-cites-confusion-over-maps-of-shebaa-farms-idUSN30254429/

Lebanon continues to call an additional area it calls the Sheeba farms for political purposes only. Harold.whatever (talk) 08:28, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done This is not a proper edit request. In addition, you clearly do not understand the history. Zerotalk 11:22, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rafale factory

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Theres nothing on the attack on the Haifa arms facility. Widely acknowledged as striking deep within. Sportsnut24 (talk) 08:34, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Casualties and losses on Israel's side

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The article states that according to Hezbollah, there are more than 2,000 casualties on Israel's side using this source for the claim. This is of course false and is Hezbollah's propaganda. This claim should be deleted. HiyoriX (talk) 13:17, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is why it says “Hezbollah claim” as it is the party claiming this casualty toll The Great Mule of Eupatoria (talk) 14:55, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ali Karaki

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Apparently dead according to many sources. 185.182.71.28 (talk) 17:16, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

War

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Should we rename this page incase of a actual war between Israel and Lebanon or make a new article? PopularGames (talk) 20:28, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Many sources are saying a war has already broken out or is about to. But the more important point is that this page isn't about the war. Its about the clashes that preceded a war, which is a notable topic in its own right. The article on war should be a new article.VR (Please ping on reply) 00:01, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've started an article here: Third Lebanon War, though I'm wondering if I should draftify it at this point. @Prodrummer619, your thoughts? VR (Please ping on reply) 00:21, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If it escalates, we can make the article with yesterday as its starting date The Great Mule of Eupatoria (talk) 11:44, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Edit Request: Update the Lebanese casualty figures

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Currently the infobox states "150+ civilians killed in Lebanon", however this is now out of date.

Today's (23rd September 2024) air strikes have killed 492 people, according to the Lebanese Health Ministry, as cited in this BBC News article.

I am formally producing an edit request, to request that this significant update to the casualty figures be made to the infobox (and wider article too, ideally). Neutral Editor 645 (talk) 22:00, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's not known how many of the deaths were civilians or militants as of now. I think it's best we wait for more details before updating the casualties. Chomik! (talk?) 22:08, 23 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It might make more sense not to distinguish at all, since it's going to be a contested number either way? Lewisguile (talk) 18:40, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request: Wrong date

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The sentence "The Security Cabinet of Israel approved a new war aim of returning evacuated residents to the north of Israel, adding to the goals of destroying Hamas and liberating the hostages." should be moved from 17 September to 16 September. Reason: The source https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cglkkrj94ldo says "The decision was taken by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's security cabinet late on Monday." Where Monday = 16 September 2024. Professor Tournesol (talk) 02:47, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. Lewisguile (talk) 08:12, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 24 September 2024

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The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. – wbm1058 (talk) 17:23, 27 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Israel–Hezbollah conflict (2023–present) → Third Lebanon War – Due to the current event that is taking place in Lebanon. Some of the news outlets started to call it the Third Lebanon War. The source of it is from The Jerusalem Post article when the security official said "I don't think it's too early to refer to these events in the Northern as the 'Third Lebanon War." along with the Atlantic Council saying that "The length of the third war will depend largely on how quickly Hezbollah will come to the table." It would be better if this paged was renamed and move instead of creating a new one in my opinion but what do you think? ... CrusaderToonamiUK (talk) 21:24, 24 September 2024 (UTC) WP:ARBECR Selfstudier (talk) 20:04, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose Even assuming current events do spark a Third Lebanon War (which seems likely), such an article should likely be its own, with this article used to describe the prelude and smaller clashes prior to the proper war (which will likely be 'officially' called if/when Israeli forces cross the border). No need to jump the gun here. BSMRD (talk) 23:04, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The strikes in recent days have been far deadlier than the past few months. This is probably the start of another war. ImYourTurboLover (talk) 00:28, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ClaudineChionh (she/her · talk · contribs · email) 00:43, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Agree. This page should be moved to Third Lebanon war or something similar. - Benjamin Netanyahu even stated yesterday in a press conference that "Israel’s War is not with you, it’s with Hezbollah", I have attached my source.[1] Gonzafer001 (talk) 04:23, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ https://www.nbcnews.com/video/netanyahu-tells-lebanon-citizens-to-get-out-of-harm-s-way-amid-hezbollah-clashes-219953221601
The quote of what Netanyahu said seems like a justification to keep the current title. Please clarify. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 20:48, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

:Question Given this has been treated up til now as a 'spillover' of the Hamas War, should we consider them one conflict or not? If not, or some sort of compromise pick, would we need an article covering everything in a broader sense (IE: Fifth Arab Israeli War for this and the Hamas war and the Houthi actions) — Preceding unsigned comment added by TheBrodsterBoy (talk • contribs) 05:15, 25 September 2024 (UTC) WP:ARBECR[reply]

There's honestly an argument for that as a kind of "summary" article. There's been direct conflict with Palestine, Syria, Iran and the quasi-state of Hezbollah (army stronger than Lebanon Armed Forces). </MarkiPoli> <talk /><cont /> 14:01, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Not described as a war by any reliable sources, so far. Viewsridge (talk) 09:59, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Even though it's definitely a war now, it's still not being called that in most RS (hesitance with no ground invasion maybe). Even those sources aren't officially calling it that by name, merely talking about it as in it's the third war after the civil war and 2006 war. Even if it was, the common name wouldn't be Third Lebanon War. </MarkiPoli> <talk /><cont /> 13:58, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Strong oppose for now. We should go by WP:COMMONNAME for now, unless or until another policy becomes more relevant. I think we need more RSes to lead on this. Lewisguile (talk) 18:42, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wait It will probably be called a war down the line but I'd wait until Israel invades Lebanon and starts capturing territory, right now RS does not refer to it as such. HadesTTW (he/him • talk) 19:04, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This RM is opened out of process by a non EC editor (only permitted to make edit requests per WP:ARBECR) and should be closed. Selfstudier (talk) 20:05, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Selfstudier. The only expression that might indicate support for the proposal is the comment from Gonzafer001, which is rather unclear/confusing. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 20:51, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Lede

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@Viewsridge: Please elaborate why you reverted my edits to the lede, without giving an edit summary? Makeandtoss (talk) 09:38, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Makeandtoss: Looks like an edit conflict, I didn't mean to revert anything, I was only updating the death toll. You can restore your edits, I'm not sure which parts I have reverted. Viewsridge (talk) 09:57, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Viewsridge: In that case please self-revert as I would be violating 1RR if I revert you. Thank you. Makeandtoss (talk) 10:43, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Makeandtoss: Which part to you want reverted? The lede. Also this is not a 1rr violation since I gave you my consent to revert. Viewsridge (talk) 14:01, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Viewsridge: Unfortunately, that was also my impression until I found out WP guidelines are implemented literally. Fourth lede paragraph as: "Significant escalation occurred in September 2024, starting with the Israel's 2024 Lebanon pager explosions, and followed by daily Israeli airstrikes that included assassination of senior Hezbollah commanders. Israel stated that its attacks would continue until Israeli citizens in near the northern border could return home safely. The deadliest and most widespread casualties in Lebanon resulted from Israeli air strikes on 23 September that killed at least 558 people and injured more than 1,835 including children, women and paramedics." Makeandtoss (talk) 14:05, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think I tried to implement what you want. Not sure, for it to be precise you will have to edit it yourself, I guess after waiting for a day. I'm not as active on Wikipedia as I was so I will probably won't be returning to this article unless a significant escalation takes place. Viewsridge (talk) 14:26, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reorganize "Events" section

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Timeline of the Israel–Hezbollah conflict (2023–present)

The "Events" section is disorganized. It is split up into 3 sections, 2 only covering up to 13 October, and the rest of time is dedicated in subsections of the last "Events" subsection.

You could make only 3 sections partially based on the template at right, "Initial clashes", "Escalation of conflict" (after the ceasefire ends), and last section as "Major Israeli attacks begin", beginning with the pager explosions, and then make subsections for specific events. Also, link to the specific timeline pages for each period or event as necessary instead of just the overarching index one. </MarkiPoli> <talk /><cont /> 07:41, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I noticed that when doing a pass for WP:NPOV. It starts detailing the current attacks but then jumps back in time. I think a chronological order makes the most sense. I would probably split Background to cover only historic stuff (pre-8 October 2023), and then move everything else into new sections based on the phase of the conflict. You can't go too far wrong with following the chronology. Lewisguile (talk) 08:02, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2000+

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@Vbbanaz05 Look, I get it. The 2,000+ casualties are likely not true. However, that doesn't really matter. That's why it says "Per Hezbollah". The point of including them is to be able to get across the claims that Hzb. makes. And, wheter the numbers are true or false, it is not wrong that Hezbollah has made them.

Therefore, they should be included. Genabab (talk) 19:12, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Viewsridge Wdyt of the above argument that the 2,000+ figure should remain? Genabab (talk) 12:27, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What do I think about it? I think it's a nonsensical propaganda claim made by a terrorist organization without any evidence. Viewsridge (talk) 19:43, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Viewsridge sure, that may be the case. However, wheter the claims are true or not doesn't change the fact that Hzb. ultimately still made them and it is important to show what Hezbollah's claims are Genabab (talk) 20:35, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nope. That is not getting included. Viewsridge (talk) 21:15, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@ViewsridgeYou're being too closeminded I think. The wikiboks for the Israeli invasion of Gaza also includes estimates of IDF casualties by Hamas. so why not this?
Again, its likely not true. We're actually in agreement here. But there's no denying that Hzb made this claim and => it should be included for documentation. That is wikipedia's policy after all. Genabab (talk) 23:05, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Add A Fact: "Israel strikes Lebanon after Hezbollah leader killed"

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I found a fact that might belong in this article. See the quote below

Israel Strikes Lebanon Again After Killing Hezbollah Leader

The fact comes from the following source:

https://www.nytimes.com/

Here is a wikitext snippet to use as a reference: 

 {{Cite web |title=The New York Times - Breaking News, US News, World News and Videos |url=https://www.nytimes.com/ |website=www.nytimes.com |date=2024-09-29 |access-date=2024-09-29 |language=en |quote=Israel Strikes Lebanon Again After Killing Hezbollah Leader}}

This post was generated using the Add A Fact browser extension.

Suddenblast1 (talk) 01:56, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The link just takes us to the NYT homepage. This can't be done unless you give specific details about the wording you'd like us to use, including any RSes. Lewisguile (talk) 12:53, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

List with all wars of israel

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Can we make a complete page with all the active wars that israel is committing to every country, every new attack can be listed there instead Nickodath (talk) 20:52, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That article exists, see List of wars involving Israel. Chomik! (talk?) 01:24, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Chomik! The Lebanese Ministry of Health announced that 105 people died and another 359 were injured in the attacks, this is typical of a war and not a conflict. I suggest changing the title of Israel–Hezbollah conflict (2023–present) to Israel's War on Lebanese Territory. 181.197.42.215 (talk) 03:59, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Israel's War on Lebanon

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I suggest changing the name to Israel's War on Lebanon. Until now, another incessant attack by the IDF towards the neighborhood in Beirut, Lebanon has been reported. Source https://www.rt.com/news/604885-israel-invade-lebanon-media/ 181.197.42.215 (talk) 23:14, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No UN resolution ever has called Shebba Farms Lebanese territory

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Shebba Farms is occupied syrian territory, syria has never officially transferred the territory to Lebanon despite Hezbollah's claims, United Nations Security Council Resolution 1701 does not mention Shebab in the withdraw to the blue line which israel did. https://press.un.org/en/2006/sc8808.doc.htmhttps://unsco.unmissions.org/sites/default/files/s_res_17012006.pdf Monochromemelo1 (talk) 02:57, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It is also important to note that this is already a war and not a conflict. 181.197.42.215 (talk) 03:52, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can you make your request in the format "Change X —> Y", giving exact wording you'd like us to use and identifying where the change is needed? We can't make any changes otherwise.
I can't presently find anywhere that says Shebaa Farms is Lebanese territory, only that it's occupied by Israel (which would be true whether it was Lebanese or Syrian). There's also a reference to Israel occupying "Lebanese territory", but this is in reference to UNSCR 1701, in which the northern half of Ghajar and the adjacent land is considered Lebanese while the south is considered Israeli. Israel currently occupies the north of Ghajar and has a fence that extends further north, into area that is unambiguously considered southern Lebanon from the POV of UNSCR 1701. So, from that perspective, that is also true, even if the village of Ghajar itself were ultimately found to be Syrian or Israeli.
On your second point, re: war versus conflict, that is something being discussed already. Usually Wikipedia follows the consensus of reliable sources, rather than leading on consensus. When most RSes start calling the conflict a "war", we have to go through a process to change the title of the article. That can take time. Hopefully that'll be decided on soon. Lewisguile (talk) 08:44, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Killed

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Hamas announced this morning that the movement's leader in Lebanon, Fatah Sharif Abu al-Amin, was killed in an Israeli attack in the al-Bass refugee camp in the Tzur region. Abu al-Amin, who is also known as Fathi al-Sharif, also served as the chairman of UNRA teachers' organization in Lebanon. He was defined by Hamas as the leader of the movement in Lebanon, and as a member of the leadership abroad. https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/rjstxhvr0#autoplay

In addition, The Palestinian Popular Front said that 3 of its leaders were killed in the attack https://news.walla.co.il/item/3694874 2.55.182.232 (talk) 06:25, 30 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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